1931 Pierce-Arrow Model differences

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  • #479671

    I have been very involved elsewhere and have been rather quiet here on these Pierce-Arrow central forums. At this moment I do have a good Pierce arrow related question. I am not very familiar with the 1931 Pierce-Arrow Models. ( I really know nothing of that vintage).  Could someone school me on the specific differences between a 1931 Model 43 Pierce-Arrow and a 1931 Pierce-Arrow Model 42 as well as the 1931 Pierce-Arrow Model 41. I am interested in basics as in options, wheelbase, transmission, engine HP and CID. I am ready to learn.

    Alan Dewsnup

    #479695

    Hi, Alan:

    I’m by no means an expert, but wondered if you’ve seen this very helpful guide/judging standards for the ’29-’31 models? Much praise to Rick and Liz Horne and Karl Krouch (and others) for taking the time to produce the video and PDF!

    1929-31 Judging Standards & Restoration Video

    This guide was most helpful to me in straightening some State title paperwork from 1931 to 1930. Hopefully it also helps answer a few of your questions…

     

    #479701

    I notice your definition of 1931 Pierces omits the earliest models, the Salon Models group, introduced in September 1930 to coincide with the annual Automobile Salon show season publicity (predating the annual automobile shows). Pierce identified them as 1931 models but they have 1930 factory chassis specifications with special trim (including the Isotta Fraschini tweak of a radiator screen). Still, new series-custom models such as the new LeBaron convertible victoria were introduced then, too, on 1930 wheelbases, later reintroduced in calendar 1931 with changed chassis. Others, such as a one-off 1930-style factory convertible version, fitted with Salon Model trim, add to make Pierce’s definition of 1931 especially interesting.

    You might check Bernie Weis’ Arrow coverage of 1931 models for his view of this.  I would also suggest taking a look at some the historic newspapers now posted on line, such as on the Library of Congress’ (loc.gov) Chronicling America or the New York State Historical newspapers (nyshistoricnewspapers.org). I like to think the digital formatting of newspaper pages offers a view of Pierce-Arrow in real time.

    Hope this helps

    Brooks

     

     

     

    #479705

    Alan,

    Here are a few pages from the ’31 Dealer Data Book. There also is a good article on ’31 models in Arrow 87-4.

    #479708

    Carl, Brooks and David, thanks to you for your responses to my question about the differences of the 1931 Pierce-Arrow model line-up. I had not even thought/considered the high end Salon versions. The Salon versions would be a study all of its own! I did watch the Judging Video, very well done. The practical information provided by David certainly helped me to understand the three different model differences. I am currently investigating a model 42 so this information is right what I need to be a bit more informed. Here is a few follow-up questions, does the Model year 1931 still have the nagging issues of broken intake and exhaust manifolds, that the 1929 and 1930 Pierce-Arrow appears to have? Does the 1931 Model year have any other inherent problems to be aware of and watch for? Are wire wheels a possibility if one desired them, for the 1931 Model year?

    Alan Dewsnup

    #479709

    Alan,

    Wire wheels are listed as an option for $90 for rear mount spare. $225 for cars including side mounts and a trunk rack. I don’t know about the manifold cracking issue, or any other issues particular to ’31.

    You might also download the ’31 Owner’s manual from the website under the Publications tab.

    The 87-2 and 87-4 Arrows have a lot of information on the ’31s. I can e-mail you digital copies if you wish.

    Dave

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    #479733

    The Data Book pages are interesting but leave out the first 1931 Salon Models made in the Fall of 1930.

    Branham’s reference guide, copies are at the AACA Library and Research Center, details what happened at the turn of the 1930-1931 model year. Pierce-Arrow appears to have been surprised at the November New York Automobile Salon by the new 145-inch wheelbases of Lincoln and Marmon – one inch longer than the longest Pierce Model A – so quickly revised dimensions of all chassis, making the longest 1931 chassis produced in 1931 have a 147-inch wheelbase. Suggesting the Data Book version above was compiled after Pierce made the dimension changes.

    I’ve made a copy of the Branham pages but they resist attachment so need to follow up by sending it separately.

    I should add a Salon Model sedan was sent to the English dealer in late 1930 (at the time a Salon Model-trimmed convertible went to the Paris Motor Show), but did not sell and was advertised by Henleys showroom in March 1931 as a demonstrator. It survived the war to become part of the Petit Pozzoli Collection in Paris in the 1960s. I am not sure what has happened after that, and hope someone can update the survivor story.

    I hope this helps

    Brooks

     

    #479734

    Here are the 1930-1931 pages from Branham’s. They Branham 1931(2)are courtesy of the AACA Library & Research center, Hershey, PA

    Brooks

     

    #479735

    I notice the Branham pages are not attaching; will try again later.

    Brooks

     

    #479736

    Brooks,

    If you email them to me as attachments, I will see if I can post them.  Also, there is a 1931 Phaeton right hand drive currently in France. It doesn’t look like a salon model.

    #479737

    Branham pages that Brooks was referencing.  As this is a jpg file, it should be loaded as an image.

     

    #479747

    Alan……besides you current great question, you should also ask why a 1931 Pierce is such a better driver than a 29 or 30. Call me if you like. In my humble opinion a 1931 Pierce is signifigantly a better car than the two earlier years. Best, Ed

    #479750

    Alan,

    We’ve had our ’31 Model 42 5p Sedan for 27 years and have driven it to MANY Annual Meets.  We also owned a ’29 133 Club Sedan for 20 years and I agree with Ed that the ’31 is a much better car.  Primary is the Ross Steering box which replaced the Gemmer.  Another nice thing is the synchromesh on second and third.  We have a very late production Model 42 and it got the ’32 tranny as a running change.  Models 41 and 42 have the big engine with counterweights on the crankshaft.  All the ’31s are equipped with free-wheeling but I don’t think anyone uses it because the brakes aren’t powered.  To get power brakes you have to buy a ’33.

    Good hunting!

    Bill

    #479763

    Alan –

    I thought posting that page from Branham’s would help clarify there being two 1931 versions of some A and B models. Such as  the one made at the end of calendar 1930 called Salon with a 144-inch wheelbase chassis and one made in 1931 with a longer 147-inch wheelbase. I am not sure how many of the rarer 1931 Salons made in 1930 survive, very few I believe, but they can be traced by car number (including the right-hand drive phaeton Dave mentions above; the running board trim could mislead, if changed later). To the extent engineering details changed during the two 1931 versions, with Salon owners becoming test drivers, I do not know. Those surviving have a story to tell.

    So hope your search includes coming across one of them. A Waterhouse-bodied convertible was listed for sale not too long ago so may have some operating details available; it would have a 139-inch B chassis.

    All the best from here

    Brooks

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