Engine serial numbers and their meaning

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My dad and I are working on a 1932 model 54 Club Sedan which has a concerning knock in the engine. We bought a spare engine, said to be from a ’32, in California, but upon arrival the engine numbers have given me concern. They are as follows;

The car: “231337” just underneath head gasket, with “K * 12 * 15” cast into the bottom end.

The spare engine: “230102”, with “K * 10 * 13”

Are these engines compatible, meaning are they of the same year, displacement, and stroke? Can the internals of the spare engine be used to rebuild the one in the car (rods, bearings, crankshaft, etc….)?

Any information regarding this matter would be greatly appreciated!

Adam Ellis

cell: 615-598-4188

email: [email protected]

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Adam,

There is a good article in the PA Service Bulletin 2008 #4. Looks like your engines are 2 months and 1235 apart.

K 12 15. Is 1930 December 15

K 10 13. Is 1930 October 13

Have you put your chassis # into the Identification Guide? It should list the range of engine numbers. The fact that these are 1930 engines seems odd if your car is a 32.

There should be a raised casting number on the side of the block,I think it starts with a 7. I would verify that but my block is in storage.

If the #’s are the same, I would think the parts would interchange. Let us know what you find. Good luck.

Bill

http://forums.aaca.org/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=733118

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Here is the bulletin.

Looking at the roster, the 23XXXX series seems correct for a ’32.

Did Pierce cast blocks 2 years ahead of time? That is a long time to age.

http://https://pierce-arrow.org/publications/pasb2008-4.pdf

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Thanks so much for the response, Bill. The bulletin link would not open, but I will find it. Much appreciated!

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Adam,

You need to drop one of the http://’s (it put in 2) at the beginning. Hope it helps.

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Dear Bill,

Yes, you are right; the casting number on the block does start with a “7”. The number is “-700860*-1”, and is the same for both engines. Does that clear anything up?

Thanks.

Adam

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Hi Adam, do you have a paper PAS Roster ? It shows that engine numbers have 230xxxx and 231xxxx fro the ’32 model 54 engines. You can use the paper roster to compare the chassis numbers with their engine numbers to see roughly what ‘spread’ there is on the ones listed.

Pierce seemed to have put a number on each engine as it was built, then tested. If the engine didn’t run well on the dynomometer, another engine was selected. It is not unusual to see 20-50 serial number jumps in the sequence of engine numbers .

So if you care to keep your original ‘sequence’ engine, the replacement one is a significantly earlier engine than would have been in your serial numbered car.

Otherwise, the engine and engine parts should interchange. for ’32, there was one 8cylinder engine, and the ‘big’ cars received the new V12 engine.

Hope this helps.

Give me a call or send me an email regarding your engine noise, I’ll see if I can help diagnose what it might be.

Greg Long

[email protected]

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The 32 block is a one year only block and is different from all others. While any eight will fit, to be correct it should have a 32 engine. Many cars don’t have the correct engine, some people do not mind the swap outs, others like myself only like to run the exact correct year and series block. It may or may not effect resale value. So it’s best to try and stay with the correct engine.

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Thanks, Greg and Edgar, that helps a great deal!

To Edgar: I agree that originality counts, and should be preserved whenever possible. I have little to go on, but I did meet the widow of the second owner who told me that the car came from Alexandria VA, and was said to be 2 owner only. It was used for extensive touring and when garaged some 20 years ago, was reportedly garaged with a spare engine and other parts which we were unfortunately unable to obtain. Car appears to be tatty but very original; I found a 1947 inspection sticker in the glove box, etc….

To Greg: Thanks for the information! I just wanted to make sure it was potentially worth my time to tear down the (seized) spare engine for parts. The engine in the car makes an ominous low-toned, RPM-dependent knocking which to me sounds like rod bearing or wrist pin. Noise gets worse when engine (oil) warms up, is worse with a load on the engine such as acceleration or going up a hill, and does not significantly improve with increasing oil from straight 30wt to 50wt. I tested compression in all cylinders and that seems good, with 6 cylinders at 82psi, one at 75 and one at 85. Engine does not smoke very much. My dad and I would like (if possible) to make the car reliable and drivable without a 30K “engine out” adventure. Any advice would be appreciated.

Also, if anyone knows the whereabouts of an appropriate “archer” radiator cap for the ’32, that would also be great. The cap on the car is without the mascot, and not in particularly good condition.

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If all else fails. Don Sommer at American Arrow has reproductions.

http://www.americanarrowcorp.com/html/product_details.php?nav_id=4&cat_id=1&product_id=57&

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I looked at it…. very nice mascot! Are they accepted in judging competition?

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PAS Member Dave Murray also makes Concours quality archers, see the Parts & Services Directory.

Blonder-Murray Reproductions

5801 38th Ave., NW

Gig Harbor, WA 98335-8237

Email: [email protected]

Phone: (253) 229-9573

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