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Happy Birthday, Dave, and many many more!

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For what it may be worth: Bill, on my 1918 dual valve I run rich (“heavy”) to just below the point where there is visible exhaust. To see if you’re running too lean (“light”), with a warmed up engine running in 4th gear at 30 mph, suddenly floor the accelerator–if it backfires, it’s too lean, and if it stumbles/loads up, you’re too rich.

The higher your speed, the more you should enrichen the mixture. These knobs do NOT function like choke knobs, which you can forget about once the engine is warm; be thinking about how rich/lean you’re running and tweak the knob every so often. Those adjustable-main-jet carbs are very handy at altitude: On the Modoc going thru 6,000 ft and on Glidden in Idaho last year at 7,000 ft, I could lean out during climbs and richen as we descended. Fixed-jet cars were puking black smoke at 7,000 ft.

There’s a near-infinite range of adjustment due to the clamp on the main jet rod. Supporting Ed’s idea of a gas analyzer, it might be useful to have that done ONCE and change the clamp position so that optimum adjustment at perhaps 40 mph UNDER LOAD at your home altitude represents “40%” rich on the amount of travel of your heavy-light knob. I do that on Series 80 rich-lean levers by ear and vacuum gauge, as I don’t have a gas analyzer. At least you’re in the ballpark.

Better to pump out some black smoke occasionally than to burn valves–and in dual valve engines, a too-lean mixture will often lead to a cracked block.

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ONE Optima turns over my 1918 48-B-5 very nicely. I run ONE in my Series 80. I run TWO in parallel in my 8-cylinder Pierces primarily for the reserve capacity during nighttime driving. Optimas have about 100 amp-hrs (AH) reserve capacity each. The Group 3 wet cell battery originally furnished in 8-cyl cars had 140 AH and the Group 4 in 12-cyl cars had 165 AH.

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Paul Johnson sent me a list of available Parts Catalogs in the PAS Library, and the years 1936 through 1938 are NOT among them. That is, in 62 years of the Society’s existence, we don’t have one. I’ll make a major leap and say PROBABLY none were issued.

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Greg and Ken, you’ve set a new Gold Standard for PAS Meets! You’re SO good at this that perhaps you should be the permanent Meet arranger

Dave Stevens, Annie and I are most grateful that you brought Percy, the 1925 80 coupe which I owned for 21 years and now owned by the Museum, and allowed us to put about 240 miles on it. That was the perfect cap for our meet experience.

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Nobody I know has ever seen a 1936 (or 1937 or 1938) parts book.

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Congratulations! Very sorry you had to go through all those hoops, but it may help to keep peace in the family that outsiders had a fair chance at the car. I think this was the best possible outcome for you, never mind all the angst getting there.

Please make every possible effort to bring yourself and the car to the Meet, because you have made a lot of friends here who are eager to help you.

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For Judging Standards purposes, may we agree that EITHER Delco or Dyneto starter and generator equipment is correct for 1934-35 cars? The PAS (not “Pierce-Arrow”) Wiring and Tuneup Guide consists of pages copied from National Service Data (NSD- aftermarket) manuals, and both are derivative (i.e., secondary) sources, whereas the Anson notes are those of a P-A engineer and thus a primary source. Notwithstanding those notes, it seems clear that for whatever reasons a number of 1934-35 cars built after the Anson dates and engine numbers left the factory with Delco equipment.

However, I suggest that both units (starter and generator) on any given car should be of the same make.

Pierce continued to use Delco *ignition* through the end. The only Dyneto equipment consisted of starters and generators.

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Paul, the Bernie Weis recension tables indicate that the change from Delco to Owen-Dyneto occurred with 1934 8-cyl engine number 305436 and 12-cyl engine number 400234. The source cited by Bernie for each is Anson’s note 18-9 dated 5/7/1934. I do not doubt that some cars built after those numbers/dates (such as yours) may well have been equipped with Delco starters and generators. Does yours have the conventional single-stage cutout as on earlier cars–or the two-stage (square box) as commonly found on the Dyneto?

For others, it’s MUCH easier –and cheaper!–to find a single-stage cutout than the two-stage….

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WOW! Way to go, Greg! I thought BobJ was the eBay king but I’ll have to re-think that….

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The Delco cutouts used through mid-1934 (when Pierce switched to Owen-Dyneto generators) originally had 266P and 265B part numbers, which were superseded in the late 1930s by the newly-standardized 7-digit Delco part number 1867781, easily found NOS on eBay by using “Delco 1867781″” as your search criteria.

That number even fits 1939 Chevrolet Standard (with 3-brush generator) and some Mercury outboard motors. Just use that “”new”” 7-digit part number.”

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Greg’s recollection is, shall I say, more “vivid” than mine of our flat in the Mojave Desert returning from the 2009 Temecula Meet on less-than-1000 miles Bedford tires with thin off-shore tubes also supplied by Lucas. That night we stayed in Bakersfield, home base of Buck Owens, as scheduled and found a tire shop first thing the following morning. The most critical info for all here is that the repro tube let go on its bonded seam. We replaced that tube with a 16″ light truck tube (what else are ya gonna find in Bakersfield on a Saturday?) which works well due to the drop center P-A wheels. That same day, a DIFFERENT new tire (had been the spare, same position: right rear) let go at 58-60 mph in 86*F weather south of San Jose on US 101. Since that was only 50 miles from home we continued without a spare (a 5-wheel car). The second tube also failed on the bonded seam. I subsequently replaced ALL the repro tubes with 16″ light truck tubes and have had no problems in 10K miles other than one flat caused by a LARGE screw through the tread.

I LOVE Bedford 17″ and 18″ tires. My 1930 roadster had Bedford 18″ blackwalls on it when I acquired it in 2002, and their tread wear is minimal–same longevity on the Bedford 17″ WSW on the SA which sees more miles. Greg and I were both impressed by how well the two Bedfords held up from flats-at-speed on hot days; those tires are still in service. Bedfords ARE large, and one needs to use Lesters and/or drop one or more sizes for fender-mounted spares. They can also be a bit noisy. The diamond tread pattern and pie-crust sidewall edges are period-correct.

I agree with Greg on the BFG repro 600x22s on Series 80s–mine are still wearing well >20 years later with no signs of age.

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Parts & Services Directory shows they’re available (16-pc set) from Blonder-Murray

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Seagrave bumped the Pierce 12 out to 531 cid, as I recall, as well as the completely different 906 cid engine in this ad. I don’t know the provenance of the 906 engine, but perhaps the Reverend Minnie or someone else can help us out.

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Not the Pierce V-12–this is the 906 cid Seagrave engine

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Merlin and Jane, thank you for yet another wonderful time!

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Here are the Multi-Beam numbers, L & R, if you want to start a standing search on eBay or elsewhere. The part numbers are cast into the glass.

1933-34 #915419 and #/915420

1935 #919017 and #919018

Dave Stevens’ repro optical-grade plastic lenses are excellent as a Q&D improvement while searching for correct lenses. Install them over the sealed beams, but paint out the exterior adapter rings as shown on Greg;s photo.

To do it right and permanently, you’ll also need a pair of reflectors which i **think** are the same for 1933, -34, and -35. Bob J will know…

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Mark, thanks for the info on the K&N AL-1001 filter. I couldn’t find one in the catalog to fit my similar 1930 silencer can (the 1930 lacks the snorkel of 1931-32), so I used K&N “filter wrap” which doesn’t come oiled, so I oiled it for installation. I added a hardware cloth cylinder on the inside (to prevent collapse under suction) and on the outside of the wrap, and new fine-mesh brass screen on the visible outside of the can to duplicate the factory outside appearance.

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I want to clarify what my dear friend of 50-odd years Bob Jacobsen said:

“P-A’s body #’s are confusing. From my records, there were at least 74 total 1934 & 1935 V12 Convertible Coupes built. Contrary to what George and Ed stated earlier, the code 338-P-xxx was used for both 1934 and 1935 V12 convertible coupes, NOT for both 1935 8’s plus 1935 12’s. The 1935 V12 conv. coupes probably restarted at 100, so we both agree that there were 33 1935 conv coupes made, and yours is #23.

“(The 1934 and 1935 8-cyl both used code 238-P-xxx and numbered 1 thru 32 (’34) and 100 thru 133 (’35) for a total of 66.)”

Allow me to clarify:

The engineering code portion of the body number is 238 for 1934-35 8s and 338 for 1934-35 12s (all body styles). P is the body style code for conv coupes, and Y is the body style code for production Silver Arrows.

The sequential number (following the P or the Y) pertains to BOTH 8s and 12s, because the same bodies for P and Y cars were used on 8s and 12s. I’ve examined the Y code records as well as Bob has the PAS P code records (which include notes from company officials on non-surviving cars) and their are no duplicate sequential body numbers on known 8s vs 12s.

For their own reasons, Pierce-Arrow began the second year (1935) with body numbers beginning with -100 (for these fewer-than-100-in 1934 bodies), and as I mentioned, not with -101 as one might expect.

Therefore, along the lines that Ed is suggesting about counterfeit 12s, a 1934 12 conv coupe should have a body tag reading 338-P-nn (2 digits) and a 1935 12 conv coupe 338-P-nnn (3 digits). 1934-35 8s body tags would read 238-P-nn/n as above. That is by far not the only thing to check to see if a car might be counterfeit/modified from production.

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I’m pretty sure the 1935 sequential body numbers for low-production body styles begins with 100 (not 101, as we might think). That is CERTAINLY the case for production Silver Arrows. Additionally, the P (conv coupe) code was used for both 8s and 12s. So this is the 23rd conv coupe (both 8s and 12s) for 1935. When I looked up this info for Johnny, I recall that the highest sequential body number known to PAS indicated 33 units. If so, at least 33 conv coupes were made, total of 8s and 12s.

Congratulations, Johnny, a magnificent find! Would love to see at at your convenience.

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