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Looks like a decent car with some sorting and adjustments could be a fun driver. Whoever put the mirrors on the car should be beaten severely over the head. I agree with Bob’s comments. I see a handful of Seagrave parts on it……it is one of those car that looks like it has good bones…….just needs TLC and time. The rear end cover has new bolts in it???????? Whenever buying a 12, you should always take along someone who is familiar with them, parts can be expensive and hard to locate. Looks like the parking light lenses are plastic.
Great car…….looks very correct. For years that is what most of us dreamed of finding hidden away in a barn or garage. Club Sedan, dual side mounts, wire wheels, has a trunk. Early tropic are heater and a radio. Not rusty, no bad wood………the “impossible” find of the 60’s,70’s and 80’s. Sadly cars in this condition are quickly becoming parts cars……..but even then, with so few cars being done over now, most of the “parts and parts cars” will now probably no longer be consumed more than ten or twenty percent of their parts. Hopefully someone will save it, but realistically it’s probably a hot rodder bidding on it. With a bit of luck the new owner will join the PAS.
The Seagrave motors in the “small” 12’s came in three sizes, the last………531 have different everything except a few small parts, thus a 531 has zero value to a Pierce car guy. The second generation small twelve has some different internals and not all interchange with the cars, so if you want to use fire truck parts, get an engine built before 1948. NOTE: Most early trucks were updated with later engines, thus MOST early trucks have engines from the 50’s installed. The 906 is HUGE and from the two I have actually seen running they make heat better than horsepower. They will pump all day long at 1800 rpm and that’s what they did best, they hardly move the truck down the road………40 mph was as fast as you would dare drive one. I have no clue who designed the 906………..but it looks like a huge industrial power plant type unit….which it is.
Installing one of these?
Bill, he called me looking for advice buying a V-12 more than a year ago, and was looking for information on several cars, he asked me if I knew your car…….helping out a friend. I have not disclosed to anyone who purchased the car, nor will I, I didn’t think there was any issue answering whether or not they were a club member. To be honest, I probably get a phone call on 90 percent of the Pierce cars offered for sale when listed here, hemmings, AACA, HCCA, ect. Often times cars that belong to friends I just don’t comment on, as I don’t wish to get involved. Since I knew your car, and your reputation as having only good cars, that run and drive better than 99 percent of what is out there, I felt comfortable in recommending the car to the new owner. FYI- I recieved calls from five different people on your car………My Best, Ed
Yes………
Great car….congratulations!
Fuel discussions can be almost endless. Molecular carbon chain analysis and stoichiometry along with heat content issues, fuel density, blending stocks……it’s enough to give you a headache. Blending stocks have changed over the years, giving way to about five basic type pump gas fuels sold to the public since the 20’s. Very long story short, regular E10 pump gas on paper should be fine for any engine………..according to the science, only problem is, it is not. From post war there are very few major problems, pre war is an entirely different story. Another long story made short……tune for performance, idle, equipment longevity. Running rich is safe, lean is a gamble. As Chris D and my father would say……Happy Motoring,
I forgot to mention cracked heads and blowen head gaskets……….been there, done that with the testing regiment!
James is 100 percent correct with his fuel analysis. The timing of plus five is fine and safe. You can go twenty more and often not cause knocking……but you will increase the combustion chamber pressure off the top of the chart, overloading the bearings. Using fuel to cool the air charge temp along with the extra oxygen works to an extent, developing more power for significant fuel mileage loss……….having tried it to the extreme, it’s possible to get as little as four miles per gallon doing it. I have experimented with all of this…..timing and fuel back in the late 90’s on my chassis dyno at my business. You can cause damage and issues if your not very familiar with what your doing. We used a five gas analyzer in the exhaust to prevent problems, and tune to maximum performance. The ultimate target area is a small sweet spot of trade offs, and not easily achieved. Most cars have incorrect carburetors and exhaust systems that drastically alter the results. For 99 percent of club members, I recommend stock settings and equipment across the board……..mistakes can cause cracked blocks, melted pistons, burned valve, and pounded out Babbitt bearings. What take the risk? Moderation is best if you can’t build your own engines……experimentation can become very costly without the right tools and equipment. Best, Ed.
Just a note…….changing the curve and adding timing can make much more power……IF the engine can take it. I would not recommend it on an old engine or back yard rebuild……….rod failure can occour when hammering on it with lots of timing…….on a new engine with inserts….go for it……….just be careful no to run too lean and melt a piston or burn a valve. Pumping up the engines is a fun pastime…….just keep your eyes open to the possible downsides. Ed
Richard…….I can assure you my friend Greg is “One of a kind!†In a good way, of course!
As usual, Cislak has light available, and if you call he he had a few “loose†lights and parts, so you may be able to get just a single can. Give him a call.
I have a wiring diagram at the shop, send me a text tomorrow to remind me at 413-530-5712 and I will send you the information. Ed
If Greg was working at a bar, and I placed my order for a beer, this is what I expect he would serve me. From my trip to the UK last year.
Best lesson…….keep the car stock. I would still at least buy the parts to make the car correct. That way you have them in hand. Many people will not consider a car that’s modified or has wrong components. Having hem on the shelf is always a good idea.
I would recommend looking at ALL the cars in that museum sale with an expert……….ALL of them. Not sure I would call that car a runabout……..
Cislak will have the drive shaft available also.
Steel check bit me….Stude cap.
I’m quite sure the 29 distributor was changed out due to the difficulty and expense of getting a correct cap. Put the car back stock, you can get a distributor for very reasonable cost…….I’m sure Cislak has one, and then you can run a study cap instead of the Pierce cap if you want to save some money. At least then the car will be correct, reliable, and whole again.
