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Jack,
I just looked at each of the Series 80 P-A cars offer by VOLO and each will need a good deal of work to bring them both up to snuff and to be correct.
Obviously, the price reflects the work that needs to be done.
The dark red one also has a non original windshield and top, and I seem to recall some PAS person writing about that car being (?) re-bodied or something weird.
Good hunting on your search.
BTW, Wayne Hancock is selling his IMMACULATE black and vermillion Series 80 Runabout at Hershey.
The price is about twice what VOLO is asking for the more expensive of the two cars they offer, but Wayne’s car is a Weis Award winning car and is FANTASTIC!
Check out the photo of Wayne’s car on this website, Past Meets section.
Peter
The car sold for $7,500 on eBay.
Randy,
Also, one of the P-A Gents who are coming to Hershey may have one.
Peter
David,
All of this Information is taken from Bernie Weis’ tables.
The estimated production runs of the Series 80 & Series 81 are as follows.
Series 80, 1925 = 4,250 (existing today = 73)
Series 80, 1926 = 7,345 (existing today = 126)
Series 80, 1927 = 6,808 (existing today = 93)
Series 80, Year Unknown = 3
Series 80 Totals = 18,403 (existing today = 295)
Series 81, 1928 = 4,700 (existing today = 94)
Series 81, S/Ns Unknown (existing today = 7)
Series 81 Totals = 4,700 (existing today = 101)
Totals Series 80 & 81 existing today = 396
The First Series 81 Body S/N is: 8101008.
The Last Series 81 Body S/N is: 8111383.
The First Series 81 Engine S/N is: 8101010.
The Last Series 81 Engine S/N is: 8111350.
I trust that this answers your questions.
Peter
Dave,
if not, get one!
I believe that you can buy them here, online.
They are invaluable.
Peter
Ask Karl Krouch, he probably has a dozen of them.
Gotta love the PAS Message Board Gents!
David,
What do you need, a diagram?
It is an interesting assembly.
Going to Hershey?
If so, bring the parts and there will be at least a dozen PAS Gents happy to show you how to assemble it.
Peter
Jack,
Apropos of Greg’s comment on the cylinder block S/N, don’t bet the ranch that they match.
When these cars overheated, it was common to crack a cylinder head or a cylinder block.
Although I NOW have the original crankcase on my 1925 Series 80, I went through three cylinder blocks on a engine rebuild a few years back (long, bad story).
Before the need for the rebuild, I am confident that the cylinder block that was on the non-matching crankcase was not the block on the original crankcase, or they would not have swapped engines in the 1930s or 1940s.
I just happen to be lucky enough that my Uncle Joe, from whose estate I bought the car, held on to the original crankcase.
Good luck with the numbers game.
Don’t be too OCD, or is that CDO (if you are really picky – alphabetical). HA!
Peter
Randy,
The base of the unit is screwed to the wooden cross members (supposed to be).
Grasp the bezel and rotate clockwise a touch and then anti-clockwise.
With luck it will move an inch or two and then come off.
If not, you may wish to take an aerosol can of silicon or some other benign lubricant, put the red tube into the squirter and carefully shoot a bit of the juice on to the interior bezel neck.
Use just a bit and use something that will not leave a stain in case you shoot too much of the juice.
Twist clockwise and anti-clockwise to loosen and with luck the bezel should unhook.
It is a bayonet lock.
Good luck,
Peter
Jack,
As with today’s etching technology on brass, one puts a stencil of the desired image on to the plate, in this case the PAMCC stuff, and then places the brass plate into an acid bath (Ferric Chloride) for a few seconds.
The acid burns out the uncovered brass and turns it black.
Then, the plate is cleaned of residual acid and the stencil removed to reveal a shiny brass image of the desired image.
Perhaps, I was incorrect about the “paint” thing, as I consider it a bit longer because there is no significant difference in elevation between the brass and the black on my S/N plate.
Again, this has nothing to do with your S/Ns.
Peter
Thus spake the Teebay,
George, you are back from the High Desert, eh?
Jack,
I was curious about your S/N and Patent plate because it looks like the letters are raised (embossed) on both plates.
If you look at the photos of my S/N plate and Jim’s, they are flat with the letters reverse stenciled painted (I verified that this evening).
Ditto for my Patent plate (painted / reverse stenciled).
I believe that the car we are discussing here has a reproduction S/N and Patent plate.
Interesting, or maybe the Runabouts had a fancier set of plates.
BTW, it is not a DeLuxe / Coach thing, as my car is a DeLuxe and Jim’s is a Coach.
Now, what that has to do with anything about matching engine and body S/Ns is beyond me.
I just love doing research.
I have been called a nit picker, and that may be accurate.
Cheers,
Peter
Jack,
Bernie’s list shows the following owners of this car, (8011282) most recent to earliest: John Wissink (2002), J. R. “Dick” Williams (1989), Century Auto Collection (??), Wallace Rank (1968) & Charles E. Burke (1965).
Boy, this one has been beaten to death, eh?
Perhaps the PAMCC S/N plate is a reproduction?
Peter
David,
How about under the front seat in the tool compartment?
Peter
Another Packard!
Jack,
As a buyer, you can make the argument that the non-original engine does have a negative to the value of the car, even if it performs as it should.
Whether or not the seller agrees is another matter.
I am confident, others will chime in on my pronouncement. HA!
The reality is, the car you are considering is a Runabout, which is arguably the most valuable of the Series 80 models.
Again, I am confident, others will chime in on my pronouncement. HA! HA!
That it is a Series 80 means that there are a lot of them relative to other Series Runabouts.
What is interesting about this car is that until 2002, it was listed as having the original engine, though Bernie apparently juxtaposed the body S/N and the engine S/N.
This, even if Jim did not find a listing in the Rosters he cited.
Perhaps one of the long time PAS Gents remember the last listed PAS owner, his car, and the story behind it.
If you decide to buy the car, you may later decide to post an Emporium Ad in search of the original engine.
If that is of interest to you, the Emporium Ad, that is, keep in mind that only a small percentage of PAS members regularly visit the website and that the PRINT version of the Emporium is published quarterly.
That means you may need to be patient for any response on the engine search.
Also, you may wish to contact some of the other Series 80 Runabout owners and get their opinions on the matter.
Keep us posted and good hunting.
Peter
Jack,
BTW, I reviewed what I have and I believe that the Roster that you seek is the 2002 Roster or earlier.
I am going to my stash today and will see if I have that floating around.
Peter
Jack,
Apropos of Greg’s comment on numbers, here is a photo of my S/N plate.
The body number and the engine number are 1,099 digits apart.
Also, my original crankcase is reinstalled so the body and engine serial numbers now match the S/N plate.
Peter
Jak,
We have lots of “wrong nuts” here in the States, but we try to keep them contained within political parties!
Peter
