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Hi- one of the problems with babbit and old cars is, when the crankshaft is ground to smooth, the babbit gets thicker to make up the difference. Babbit, while a great bearing surface, is a very poor heat conductor. Thus, thicker babbit means more heat retained, shorter bearing life, premature failure.

There’s a place in California (and I’m sure others could do it) that builds up the side of rods, and fits a modern bearing insert into the rod. The purists may be aghast, but it makes for a more reliable engine when rebuilding.

I like keeping things original, but some things can be re-engineered with not affecting the original “feel”” of the car.”

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Tony, your last paragraph is well said and I agree totally.

I don’t have anything against hot rods, except when it involves a rare car, and any Pierce is rare when compared to a lot of makes of cars.

My ’31 Pierce phaeton was driven over 50,000 miles, in the 60’s and 70’s, by the then-owner from New Orleans. He toured the South extensively. It was never on a trailer while he owned it. I’ve not driven it to that extent, but have taken it on many tours, it can be driven anywhere, and it’s very reliable.

best- David Coco Winchester Va.

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The answer is, sure it’ll work. Then what you’ll have is a cobbled up semi-hot rod that won’t be welcome at antique car events, and the hot rodders won’t like either. It shouldn’t cost that much to do an eight engine, unless it has something major broken in it. Talk to people in the hobby and find out who does what work at reasonable rates, and keep the car original if you can. Good luck. David Coco – Winchester Va.

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http://www.windshieldframes.com/ NC Industries can make one for you, if you have a pattern, or an excellent drawing with dimensions..best- David

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Agreed, extra is always better. And if hides have defects, it takes more of course. Was at Hershey buying hides for a friend’s car, at the Hirsch tent. Was inspecting each hide, looking for scratches and fly eggs and such (flys lay eggs in a living cow hide, eggs dry up when leather made, and you can stretch a piece of leather and all of a sudden POP up come the eggs and a big scar). Bill Hirsch walked over, what are you doing, he asked. Checking quality of leather I replied. No No, all my leather is perfect he says. Fun. You can usually figure that on a car job you’ll have 1/2 to a full hide of scraps, ends, bad leather etc. Best- David C.

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Hi- a touring car (seats, doors, quarters, kick panels) usually takes 6 to 7 good hides (50 square feet, minimal defects in leather). This can vary slightly, of course, for example, a lot of tourings have leather covering the back of the front seat, and that’s a large area. Jump seats would add square footage. Some carpet has leather binding, so there you’d need to get a piece of a hide skived and formed into single edge binding. Some defects in leather can be hidden in sewn seams, so style of interior matters too. From that you should be able to judge how much of a closed car you can do. You might get seats and doors done with 6 hides, but rear quarters and headliner would need to be other material. I’ve only done one car with a leather headliner, a Cunningham coupe, and that is no fun, headliner needs to be a light material. Best- dc

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Probably 12 to 16 yards, depending on fabric design, pleats, etc. That’s a minimum of 3 for each seat, 1 for each door, 2 for quarters and misc. Another 3 yards of headliner material, if your material is wide enough to reach side to side inside top. Without measuring the car or a similar one can’t get any closer, unless someone has upholstered same. I can tell you a lot closer on leather and top material for an open car, done a bunch of them! best- David Coco Winchester Va.

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clean metal very well, apply some JB Weld, then re-thread. Other than machining an entire frame, that’s worth a try. best- David Coco Winchester Va.

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I agree, this message board should be for hobbyists, and not used for advertising, which is what Mr. Kumar is doing. He has also used rosters in the past (CCCA and possibly PAS) as mailing lists, I for one have gotten letters from him, as I’m sure many of you have.

Mr. Kumar, please use normal advertising channels, and quit using club rosters and forums as a “cheap” tool for trying to find cars to resell.

I’m not particularly concerned about offending you, because you’ve offended us by acting in this manner. David Coco Winchester Va.

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Hi- am not sure what you are referring to on the leather, if it’s just leather work I could do it for you, send me a picture, [email protected]

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Leo, I agree that the lining is critical, but the first thing that they need to determine is if the lining is bad at all. The ’34 sedan that I did long ago (early 80’s)was a fairly low mileage car (50K or so) that I fully restored, but the braking system only needed cleanup, the original lining was fine. And, as mentioned, it would stop the car incredibly fast. The only heart stopper is when the car is barely moving, and the lag between hitting the brake pedal and actuation gets interesting…best- David C.

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I agree, don’t do it, I had a 1934 that I restored, and all I had to do was clean up the system and make sure all the linkages were free, and the brakes were fantastic. That said, the comment about “stay with the stock wheels and tires” has me thinking that maybe this is a hot rod in the making, and the original engine and transmission have been replaced with something new. In that case, you don’t have brakes, and some conversion is necessary. Also, in that case, you might not have full cooperation on this forum. All conjecture, so I’ll ask, why do you want to even consider changing what is, arguably, one of the best period braking systems available? David Coco

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Hi Clay, your comment “but a viable group also needs to take into account not inflating the market for the groups own good and to truly take a realistic approach to a finished product” sort of baffles me. The members of the PAS are not inflating the cost of Pierce Arrow cars, the market has done so. For a long time, if a Pierce was worth X, a similar year and model Packard was worth 2X. Now, the Pierce cars have reached an equal price level, and I’ve actually heard people state that they are amazed at that fact.

Value, or cost, of a Classic automobile, is the proverbial double edged sword. It’s great that they’re valuable when you already own them, but when you’re looking to acquire one, it’s easy to complain how expensive they are.

As for new-comers to the hobby, it’s a matter of having reasonable expectations of what you might acquire. There are plenty of 30’s Pierce sedans that become available (and no, I don’t mean hundreds, but at any one time there are a few for sale). Many of these are nice older restorations, and can be had in the 25K to 35K range. Expensive, one might say, yet we go out and buy a new car in the same price range without blinking an eye, and just pay the note each month. At the end of of 5 or 6 years, the new car is worth a fraction of the original purchase price. The Pierce? Possibly as much as you paid for it, maybe a little less if worn from some good touring, maybe a little more depending on market conditions.

Thus, if potential younger members would look at it in that context, the entry into the wonderful world of Classics (and Pierce Arrow in particular) is very possible. Best – David Coco Winchester Va.

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Hi- didn’t notice the ’35, it is a much better car from a condition standpoint. That said, there are still things to watch for. Make sure all lenses are glass, for example, not plastic reproductions. And, in my humble opinion, it’s still a little pricey. If the paint were better, maybe, but paint appears to be gone beyond what one might want to keep as original. Good luck with your search, I think the earlier 30’s are more attractive cars, but the 36-38 are great drivers, with overdrive and such. The ’36 I sold, we got it running and driving after being in dead storage after 50 years, and it drove and rode, as is, better than my “driver restored”” 31 phaeton! best -David Coco Winchester Va.”

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Hi- from the pictures, it’s missing a lot of expensive parts, carb, bumpers, etc. I sold a complete, running and driving, 1936 club sedan at Hershey a couple years ago. Also needed restoration, but had the goodies, bumpers, sidemount covers, etc. Got 12K for it, an amount that actually surprised some experienced Pierce people (who didn’t think that particular unrestored car was worth that much). Great cars, but very expensive to restore. This particular car you mention is the proverbial “if they gave it to you free, you’d be upside down by the time you finished restoring it.” My advice is to go find a good complete, possibly older restoration, and pay a note at the bank instead of paying for chrome, paint, upholster, engine work, parts, etc. Best- David Coco Winchester Va.

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Amen on the lag time. I restored a ’34 840 in the late 70’s. The brake system was in excellent condition, but I’ll never forget the first time I was coasting along, very low speed, and went for the brakes. Yes, they engaged, but after a lag that had my heart in my throat. It is a great system, just one that takes a little getting used to. Hydraulic brakes, you put your foot down and feel the back pressure. The SW system, you put your foot on the pedal and start “thinking” stop, your foot eases down, and next thing you know, you stop. Really nice, once you get used to it, which takes very little. David Coco Winchester Va.

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Hi- I have a pile of Pierce fuel pumps that I have accumulated over the years, let me know some description or numbers and I’ll see if I have something, if John can’t help you. thanks David Coco

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Hi- Scott- I’ve sent you an email, will be glad to discuss this car with you, I live in Winchester and know Bruce and his car well. I think you would be happy with how it drives, and it has been worked on by a local old-time car mechanic who knows what he’s doing, and it should be very reliable. It is very nice cosmetically, as within the last few years it has had paint work and new interior. best- David Coco

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Hi to all- these engines have been sold, thanks David C.

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OK, that’s great, what a beautiful car for display! See ya up there, Ed! dc

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