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Ken Muellner, just be ready to switch on the electric supplemental pump if the engine stumbles on a hot day. Occasionally I’ve found it useful to turn on the pump just prior to stopping for fuel and for five minutes after fueling on a hot day, due to the potential for seat soak and vaporization while the engine is off for fueling.
As so many have already said, the friction surface with the road (rear tires only) is the primary limiting factor of stock brakes. The greatest improvement might be in adding FRONT brakes (would almost have to be hydraulic) to effectively double the friction surface with the road.
My sense is that the hand brake (external contracting, unless it’s been changed) is about three times as effective (seat of the pants) as the service (foot) brake. As the two Tonys (Costa and Wollesen) taught me, slow with the foot brake, finish the stop with the hand brake. And for a “sincere” stop, be on both of them from the start–and be prepared to do that. Keep the hand brake from locking up, ease off pre=lock–when you’re skidding you have no control. This is where driving SKILL comes in, and is part of the fun of these machines.
I heartily endorse Jeff Adkins, dba Moose Motors in Penngrove, CA, just up the road from this year’s annual meet, as a brake relining source.
Bill, you might want to contact Dana Morgan of CA (doesn’t frequent the message board but will probably be at the meet), who has installed disc brakes on the rear of his 1915 48 touring.
Pierces from 1932(?) forward had 342 sq in of swept brake surface, about 30% more than a Cadillac V-16, which itself did not have hydraulic brakes until 1937 or later. Mechanical brakes DEMAND periodic adjustment to remain effective, and are less forgiving in this regard than juice brakes. This is especially true of the 1933-35 S-W power units, whose brake pedals do not drop as the shoe linings wear; accordingly, my 1934 gets a brake adjustment every 3,000 miles.
I’m late to this party, but I thoroughly endorse Lock-n-Stitch. They saved a block for me and the cost was very reasonable. They are (or were at the time I used them) the casting repair vendor for Peterson Caterpillar and for Northern California Waste Management (major national trash collection firm), both of which have very costly castings among their equipment subject to severe usage.
Jim, I did have a 1969 Caprice 2-door hardtop from 1996-2001, from an elderly neighbor who thought I should have it when she stopped driving. It was what I called “a really big Binaca,” with a trunk I called “the Grand Canyon.”
But I found the gasket in 1994 when I took the old gasket into a parts house and tried to match it up. Necessity is the mother of invention!
For the S80, you can use a Chev 350 flange gasket if you enlarge the holes outward slightly–and they’re CHEAP! Take your old gasket in and match it up, and you’ll see.
Bill Marsh, your 1916 Pierce (and those through 1920) was originally equipped with grease cups on most lube points, which required VERY frequent attention, “turning down” each grease cup daily for the most part. However, on your car those cups have been modified with zerk fittings, so you can use a conventional grease gun and limit attention to every 800-1,000 miles for those because the grease gun dispenses much more product at much higher pressure. Don’t overdo on the rear wheel bearings! One stroke on the grease gun will suffice.
There are vendors today who sell grease cups modified with zerks for some rather dear amounts. Use what ya got….
Bill Marsh, congratulations on the rapid progress! Hope you and Anne come to the Annual Meet here in Califunny.
Bill Scorah, the garage you saw with the turntable almost certainly belonged to my late friend Jon Lundberg. His house on The Uplands was technically Berkeley but only a couple of hundred yards from the Oakland line, and less than 1/4-mile from the late John Parks’s stash of three Pierces immobile from 1959 to 2016 but all are now being enjoyed by new owners.
Mid-way in 1925 S80 production, the road draft tube on the timing case cover was discontinued and replaced by a tube leading from the rear valve cover to the carb air horn (see photo). A similar system was kept for later Pierces and different engines. Of course there is no PCV installed, so this is a straight vent but I don’t think the vacuum sucks any oil out of the valve chamber or starves the valve stems for lubrication.
My first Pierce, the early 1925 S80 sedan with road draft tube on the timing cover, was also subject to sticky intake valves, despite a well-worn engine.
Randy and all Series 80-81 owners: I found that I would get sticking intake valves on both my 80s (including one which went to a new owner two years ago) in the spring after a period of minimal use over the winter. This usually occurred about 10-20 miles into the first spring run. The car with the better engine got stickier faster! The solution which worked for me, once the valve(s) were unstuck, was to routinely add Marvel Mystery Oil (MMO–available at Walmart) to the gas when filling at a rate of 4 oz. per 10 gallons of fuel, at least every other tankful. Once I began that regimen, I never had sticky valves again.
To expedite cleaning the deposits off your intake stems at your current point, try dribbling MMO into the carb while running the engine at 1000-1500 rpm, perhaps using a trigger-style oil can. Remove the “mushroom” but leave the cast aluminum air horn in place. Do this outside, because it will smoke like a stove filled with green wood–but may also kill mosquitos in your neighborhood.
(After checking my records) Or try member George Sterie in Grapevine, TX, who had some made up 10-12 years ago.
A few years ago I was able to buy NORS S80 valve springs from Then & Now Automotive in MA–the people who also rebuild fuel pumps. I bought two seta of 12 and used them all.
In my experience, 600W thickens and turns almost tar-like over decades. Long-term storage seems to aggravate this process. The worst I found was in an all-original Locomobile Sportif, whose lube did indeed appear to have the consistency of chassis grease, and hardening chassis grease at that.
The 1918 48-B-5 (and earlier) have two differential plugs, one about 1.5 inches (from memory) above the other, on the right side of the diff (there is no rear cover as on later cars). The manual dictates removing both plugs and filling through the top hole until the liquid grease (600W) runs out the lower hole. To me, this indicates the oil was so thick that it would build up in the chamber without exiting if only the lower hole was used, resulting in an overfill condition.
And, Bill Marsh, there is also a separate single fill plug for the pinion, also on the right side. Since there is a single plug, be careful to avoid the buildup of product above the level of the hole, so as not to overfill. I use a one-quart squeeze bottle with a tapered/pointed screw-on tip; as I recall, the bottle originally held Lucas additive.
My apologies for the confusion about documents: I was referring to the Operation & Care (owner’s) manual specific to the cars being discussed.
By the way–and someone correct me if I’m wrong, Pierces thru 1920 used grease cups, not fittings. The 2-pin Alemite fittings are correct for 1921 thru about late 1924/early 1925 when zerk fittings (press-on or ball fittings) were used on Series 80. The manual specifies that about 20 such grease cups be turned down DAILY. Most RHD Pierces I’ve seen have had 2-pin Alemite fittings substituted for grease cups, especially where visible as on spring eyes. the Alemite fittings permit substantially longer greasing intervals, as more product is applied under much greater pressure. And I’ve seen many of these cars with (horrors!) modern zerk fittings on the four universal joints which need service about every 400 miles–at least that’s my frequency.
Our fine member Dave White has been investigating the suitability of modern Extreme Pressure (EP) gear oils for assemblies containing yellow metals. He’s vacationing in Europe, otherwise he’d be all over this discussion. Within the next day or two, I’ll add an illuminating link to a clearly written not-too-technical article that Dave found.
I think most of us will agree that IF there is a modern gear oil product that is superior to the OEM “600-W” steam cylinder oil, we’ll use it. A summary of the burning issue: Most if not all EP oils use sulfur which is corrosive to yellow metals, and one can smell the sulfur in the product. An ASTM copper corrosivity test protocol says a product is safe for yellow metals is the test result is “1a” as I mentioned earlier, but there are complications described in the srticle–which is not accessible to me as I write this.
We’ll all welcome your ideas and especially your rationale.
Paul, this maybe a situation in which materials have improved. Grease channels and will be wiped from the teeth. The 1918 48-B-5 manual specifies for the steering gear CASE “one gunful of liquid grease” and cup grease for three grease CUPS for bearings/bushings in the steering column. “Liquid grease” was also called “Special Compound” by Pierce-Arrow, both of which are 600-W steam cylinder oil, but there are better materials on the market today. We can/should use hypoid oil IF AND ONLY IF the results of the copper corrosion test are 1a. Please look at the document(s) –like I just did– and see if you agree.
Craig, you said, “Another thing I noticed about the AGM type batteries is that a standard, old style battery charger will not effectively charge them.” My take is that old style chargers are fine *IF* you run them for a period of time and then shut them off. That is, as you allude, they don’t dial back/shut off from their “reading” of the Optima’s state of charge. Our cars don’t have high-tech electronic regulation, either…
Peter, yes the good ol’ battery lift strap which attaches to the battery posts is the one I was referring to in that statement.
I run Optimas in all my vintage cars and love them. I run a pair in parallel on the 8-cylinder cars for the reserve capacity (see below), not for better starting. Two things to remember about Optimas:
1. Do NOT use a lift strap to install or remove,
2. If an Optima’s charge is quite low (e.g., 5.7V or less), it will not take a charge UNLESS you hook it up in parallel with another 6V battery (preferably another AGM but wet cell OK too) with over 6.0V for the charging process.
Reserve capacity of an Optima 6V is 100 ampere-hours (AH). *-cyl Pierces came with 140 AH Group 3 batteries, 12s with 165 AH Group 4s. So it takes a pair of Optimas to meet–and exceed–OE equipment. Cars thru most of 1934 has 25 amp generators which drop to 17 amps when the temperature compensator kicks in after a few minutes, even with the third brush turned up all the way. (Yes, there was a higher output generator available, a Delco 955 perhaps.) Any long night drives will have a charging deficit, so the longer reserve is very helpful.
Thank you, Gents! This car (no, AUTOMOBILE) gives me more smiles per mile than any other I’ve ever driven. The video was done in April 2017 and I had 20 seconds to sort-of compose my thoughts before the camera rolled. Now I have 3,000 miles on it, with more planned for this year, including our Annual Meet in Rohnert Park, CA, July 9-13. I’ll be delighted to give you a ride!
As some know, I’m the (permanent) Secretary of the Nickel Age Touring Club, a VMCCA chapter, and in that capacity I was contacted on other business by Ray Maxfield, who produces this electronic VMCCA newsletter. He said he googled me and came up with that video, and asked permission of me and Blackhawk Museum to run it. There’s no privacy on the internet, as we are all finding out…
Truly and eloquently said, Curtiss. And thank you very much for the superb presentation at the PAS Board Meeting on the PAS Facebook page which you administer so well.
PAS is indeed a family (perhaps including a couple of crazy uncles) and mini-meets such as this one foster that aspect of the organization as much or more than the summer annual meets. The winter meets don’t have the “distraction” of the cars we love and allow us all to focus on the people and the personal relationships that make the PAS a Society, not just a club.
Bill, thank you for the very kind and generous words, but my capabilities on pre-1921 Pierces pale next to those of Bill Lawton, Bill Scorah, Peter Fawcett, and several others–you just haven’t met those founts of knowledge yet, and much of my knowledge came from them! It’s a learning curve, but a most enjoyable one! And the PAS is all about sharing our individual knowledge and passing it on to the next Pierce owner.
Profound thanks for sharing your amazing collections (not just cars) with Annie and me, and with Dave and Donna White. We had a marvelous time with you and Anne enroute to Callaway Gardens.
So THAT’s why I had to adjust my brakes after you went home after the Minden meet! 
The 1933-35 Stewart Warner power brakes are very effective when you’re moving–the faster the speed, the greater the power assist, but are downright scary when you’re barely moving. Worst case is backing downhill to parallel park, when there seems to be a one-second lag before anything happens.
Additionally, with that system, the brake pedal does NOT drop as the brake linings wear, so add a brake adjustment at 3,000 miles to your maintenance schedule. If you don’t do it on that schedule, your first inkling that you should have adjusted your brakes is when you slide through a stop sign or light–or worse, collide with the rear of a stopped vehicle.
As long as you mind those aspects, you’ll love that system. And the minor brake adjustment can be done in 30 minutes or less.
