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Bill,

From my Parts Books –

P/n 700398 is used on ALL ’32 – ’35 8’s and 12’s, worm AND hypoid,

and I’m pretty sure (no parts book) on ALL ’36-’38). They are 10-spline.

P/n 123862 is used on all ’30s (and probably ’29s).

P/n 744147 is used on all ’31s.

Cheers,

Bob

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Hi Mika,

I am in Los Altos, CA, about 70 miles north of Monterey, and would be happy to show you our ’33 and ’34 Pierces, and some engine work on another ’34 engine. There are at least a dozen more Pierces in collections within another 40 mile radius that I think we could arrange to see. I am available after May 19 and could set up your visit. Your message says you will be in CA from May 15 to May 23?

Let me know.

Bob Jacobsen

Director, Northern California Region, PAS

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Hi Chris,

The Metropolitan Motor Co. is listed as 1841 Euclid Avenue in the 1907 Owners Manual. (Euclid and East 19th Street in the 1908 Manual.)

The 1910-11 catalog lists The Western Reserve Motor Car Co., at 6604-6618 Euclid Avenue.

The 1914-15 sales catalog lists Weaver-Twelvetree Co., at 1821 East 13th Street, N.E.

The 1916 thru 1919 sales catalogs list Fred P. Brand Motor Co., at Carnegie Avenue and East 46th Street.

After that, the company apparently stopped listing dealers in the catalogs.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Bob Jacobsen

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Tony-

The ’34-’35 parts book indicates no suffix on the part number for the water manifold for the 8, meaning probably a black engine enamel. The 12’s part number has a -J suffix, indicating Japanning, again a black finish. !933 water manifolds were listed as no finish (black) for the 836, Japan for the 1236, and Nickel (-N) for the 1242,47.

Notwithstanding all of this, many owners plate theirs in 1247 fashion.

Happy New Year!

Bob

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And how about this ’30 that “Sunny” Jim Rolph, governor of California in ’30 campaigned in? (Enlightening front end…)

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Any idea whether this 1934 conv sedan still exists?

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Hi Jim,

Member Eric Rosenau (at his restoration shop in southern Calif.) welded and machined my original rods for my 1933 Eight over 30 years ago. I can’t remember what inserts we used (Oldsmobile?), but he could tell you. Been fine ever since. Give him a call.

Bob

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Ed,

A good deal on a “barn find” was brought to me. Couldn’t pass it up. 1922/23 KLDH 4-Pass Sport Touring. Four valve per cylinder, 360 cu in four cylinder.

Bob

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Hi Dave,

Try Dave Murray in WA.

Cheers,

Bob

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Hi Rich,

My National Service Manual lists 1932-1936 P-A clocks as using a 5 amp fuse.

Cheers,

Bob Jacobsen

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Mika,

Definitely 4 guys to lift the hood, certainly when the car has nice paint on it! Here’s a little trick, though – you can remove the side panel hinge rods, and then the side panels one at a time, to get rid of more than half of the weight, then two guys can do the top part easier. (You can even slide the two top panels apart.)

The rods can be knocked slightly forward with a drift punch on the rear end, then the forward end chucked in an electric drill, and spun while pulling out. A little WD-40 helps.

Cheers,

Bob Jacobsen

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Alan,

I do not know about the ’36-’38 chassis, but the 1934-5 12 chassis is the same as an 8 except for: The front springs have one more (12) leaf on the twelve, and the rear engine mount brackets are riveted in the forward holes for the twelve, and the aft holes for the longer eight-cyl engine.

Bob

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Tony-

My Victor catalog shows 954 to be 1936-38 Pierce.

Some scribbles in it put Fitz 911 next to 1929-35 Pierce.

Happy Holidays,

Bob

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Hi Scott,

I assume you’re speaking of the small twelve (Model 1236, 429 cu in) chassis. (The big (462 cu in Model 1242 and 1247) 1933 twelves did not have worm gears, but torque arm hypoids, with ratios of 4.58:1 and 4.82:1, depending on wheelbase and body style.)

The worm gear ratio on my 1933 839 7-pass sedan was 4.29:1, although I have replaced it (factory-approved process, described in an original P-A Company service bulletin) with a 1934 hypoid assembly. I have the Timken prints for this worm gear and wheel set. They were supplied in ratios from 2.78:1 (believe it or not!) to 4.57:1 for other cars. In addition to the 4.29:1, the 1236 may have used a 4.43:1, don’t know.

Cheers,

Bob

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Hi Scott,

Having driven my ’33 and ’34 in all conditions I can attest to the fact that these are the best power brakes on an old car. The system can only fail suddenly in the same way any mechanical braking system could fail, that is, if a clevis pin fails or a cotter pin drops out, or a cable fails. All very unlikely.

The system is very different from a vacuum “power assist” system – it is a FULL power system. The force for the brakes that pulls the cables on is derived from a clutch that is driven by the drive shaft. All the pedal does is “modulate” or control how hard the clutch is engaged – no power comes from your foot. The clutch wears very slowly, and will give plenty of warning before it needs to be relined. If for any reason the system should fail, the handbrake still works (unless the cables fail). The whole thing was explained in a brouchure “A New Way to Stop a Motor Car”, which was reproduced in Arrow 66-2. The Stewart-Warner explanatory brochure was published in PAS Service Bulletin 1974-1.

Cheers,

Bob Jacobsen

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Doug,

Coker lists the parts on page 40 of their catalog.

The 2.5″ covers are E-90500, the reducer nuts are F-90501.

(The stem numbers (with small diameter threaded top and larger diameter threaded bottom) are not shown.)

Another option is “faux” covers for rubber stems – their number 90902.

I have not tried them.

Cheers,

Bob

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Doug,

I agree with all said so far, but I’m gonna throw a monkey wrench in, just to be nit-picky. If you want a 100-point show car (as opposed to a driver) especially at a non-Pierce event (there is nothing mentioned about valve stems in the PAS judging manual, so they are up to judge’s discretion), you may want metal threaded valve stems, with tall nickel plated dust covers, as shown in most Pierce factory photos (’35 Silver Arrow attached – covers barely visible). I have had them on my ’33 for many years, and they can be applied to any tube, although their use is just one more thing that has to be done correctly to be reliable. I believe Coker has the correct style. My two cents. Your ’33 looks gorgeous.

Bob

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Joe,

One intent was to use the experience of others to help confirm or contradict my results with 2 gearsets. The other was to establish the probability of “on the shelf” sets having a problem.

I don’t think we are quite at the point of predicting whether the “on the shelf” sets have a problem, but close to it. I have sent back two sets of Phil Bray’s 3.65 ratio, the first of which wore out in 2000 miles, and the second (which I had on the shelf for another car) would not set up properly (ratcheting noise). I have not had an analysis from Phil yet.

Many factors can bear on the issue – setup, lubrication, bearings, etc.

Bob

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Hi Scott,

I love the Columbia overdive (OEM 2-speed rear end) in my 1947 Ford. I actually got 20 mpg on one trip, cruising at 60. That said, I would like to hear from any PAS members who have installed overdrives on their 1933-1935 Pierces (with Stewart-Warner power brakes).

Bob Jacobsen

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Hi Roger,

The 1936 eight came equipped with the same type of full flow filter as ’33 thru ’38. There are big (1/2″) external pipes between the crankcase, oil cooler, and external pressure regulator. It is absolutely essential that if you install a filter (as the factory did) between the lower crankcase pump output (nearest the dipstick), that you use a full-flow filter and 1/2″ lines. ALL the oil must go through it. The filter was a Purolator L-4 (not available anymore). Several replacements were available over the years, but probably not anymore (Purolator P-48-06, Fram F-30-P2 and FH-6-PL 001, and Baldwin P-80). I believe member Bob Sands has a kit available that looks like an L-4, but is split and screws apart to accept a modern full flow filter.

If you do not care about original looks, you can use a Fram HP-1 screw-on with bracket kit, and mount the bracket on two water jacket studs (same mounting centers) and use hydraulic hose (1/2″ I.D.) for connections.

If you do not have an oil cooler, just run one line from the tee at the filter output to the upper crankcase hole (to rear of water pump), and one to the external pressure regulator (screwed in the hole ahead of the water pump near the generator).

This subject has been discussed thoroughly in past service bulletins – please obtain an index so you can use them to best advantage.

Best of luck,

Bob Jacobsen

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